[1:02 PM]GMaia: Hello, I am Axel but I prefer to use a pseudo for my hobby therefore, GMaia. I am from Italy, 49, happily married with 2 wonderful kids!
[1:02 PM]GMaia: Let me introduce myself: I am a former player and GM, I started in 1983 with the first Italian edition of D&D, the red box with Elmore cover. I do not play since 2017, I have not anymore time to dedicate to my hobby.
[1:03 PM]GMaia: By the end of 90s I also started collecting. I have a quite ‘good’ collection: nearly all of them are focusing on fantasy RPGs, the greatest part is referred to the early period, from 1974 up to the 80s. Even here I stopped collecting since a couple of years… actually nearly stopped… from time to time I still buy something.
[1:04 PM]GMaia: Now, the last activity within the same scope is writing. I started in 2021 thanks to Covid lockdown… the first step was the core rules of VI·VIII·X, but this is actually only the first part of a wide project which includes also other parts still to be developed and properly written!
[1:05 PM]GMaia: Today I will be happy to talk about the VI·VIII·X core rules and explain its underlying model, which I called KUP. I am not against the overall project, therefore if there is an interest in it we can talk also about it (there is a second underlying purpose with the setting for instance…).
[1:06 PM]GMaia: One last remark at this stage: my apologies for my English! I will try avoid mistakes but a live session will likley call them!
[1:07 PM]GMaia: Thanks for your invitation here and let’s start then!
[1:07 PM]GMaia: (done)
[1:08 PM]Dan the GMshoe: Thanks, @GMaia! The floor is open to questions!
[1:08 PM]Dan the GMshoe: What is the significance of the game’s name?
[1:09 PM]GMaia: Fair point: I have never thought to the name till the very last moment… At the end I decided to go with a name which recalls two things:
[1:09 PM]GMaia: 1. is the lagacy from the past (the setting will be centered on a fall Roman-like empire)
[1:10 PM]GMaia: 2. a name which is not something&something or other similar titles…
[1:11 PM]GMaia: Btw: it reads six-eight-ten!
[1:11 PM]GMaia:
[1:11 PM]Dan the GMshoe: I take it that this is a fantasy game?
[1:12 PM]GMaia: It is indeed, or better: the setting will be fantasy. In the rules you can derive it as you can find magic spellcasting rules which lead to a fantasy setting
[1:14 PM]GMaia: If I may add: last week I had a very interesting conversation with a collector fellow who proposed me to develop a setting-neutral set of rules starting from the current one… this is somenthing I put on my “to do” list!1
[1:14 PM]Dan the GMshoe: Can you give us an overview of the setting?
[1:15 PM]GMaia: Wow! Sure! Please be aware that I wrote not even half of it for the time being…
[1:15 PM]Dan the GMshoe: No worries!
[1:15 PM]GMaia: The world is a medieval-like world with a tech level similar to our 1000ad1
[1:16 PM]GMaia: I centered the scene into a land previously rules by an empire similar to the Roman empire.
[1:17 PM]GMaia: There was also a rival, a maritime powerful country similar to the Phoenician culture
[1:18 PM]GMaia: A catastophic event happened nearly 1000 years before and this country was nearly destroyed
[1:19 PM]GMaia: This was due to a divine intervention towards a emperor who discovered an ancestral secret which should not be unveiled to mortal beings
[1:20 PM]GMaia: This event led to the complete obliteration of this culture and made it that no one is able to remind what has happended
[1:20 PM]GMaia: The world is now plenty of ancient unknown ruins1
[1:21 PM]GMaia: There are also extremely long tunnels connecting several countries (and no one knows thier origins)11
[1:21 PM]Beyla 🎉: Is there magic in this game?
[1:22 PM]GMaia: There is a guild, similar to our inquisition, which wanders these lands trying to find the secret of these events
@Beyla 🎉Is there magic in this game?[1:22 PM]GMaia: Yes, both arcane magic and divine!1
[1:23 PM]GMaia: There are special NPCs (which cannot be played as PCs) called ‘eidolon’ who are avatars of the primordial deities1
[1:24 PM]GMaia: They have a special role in the world: the are there to rebalance any fact which brings towards an unbalance1
[1:25 PM]GMaia: This is a very important key in the setting: I don’t like grim and dark settings.. I want to provide the world with a hope (which is not only on the shoulders of the players)1
[1:25 PM]Dan the GMshoe: How powerful does magic get that’s accessible to mortals?1
[1:25 PM]GMaia: I want to build a ‘positive’ setting1
@Dan the GMshoeHow powerful does magic get that’s accessible to mortals?[1:26 PM]GMaia: Magic in the divine form is a channelling of divine entities…
[1:27 PM]GMaia: It is similar to the D&D concept with the difference that a spell has 3 level of power which can be ‘unlocked’ as the divine spellcasting skill of a character goes up
[1:29 PM]GMaia: Sorry, before I go ahead with the arcane magic, I would like to somehow close the setting description: this is a rather complex story where there are primordial deities, thier avatars and lastly the new gods.
[1:29 PM]GMaia: Everything is explained in the ‘cosmogony’, a short book I have written which explains these details and the origin of the world1
[1:31 PM]GMaia: since the setting is not yet done, I have not published it… It will be like a short story which is integrated into the setting by the fact that the ‘hero’ of this world will discover it and start to teach it to the people, like a prophet or better a philosoper1
[1:31 PM]GMaia: ok, back to magic!
[1:33 PM]GMaia: The arcane magic is, needless to say, tied to the setting as well: from a game mechanics perspective it is a free-form magic. The caster knows 2 words, one is an element (a noun) the second is a principle (verb). In order to cast a spell, the player decide these two words and the effect he wants his PC will produce
[1:34 PM]GMaia: from a setting point of view, these words are bound to the primeval elements and principles which have been used to generate the universe1
[1:35 PM]GMaia: This means that they are part of the universe and are somehow connected with it
[1:36 PM]Dan the GMshoe: Does each caster only know one element and one principle?
[1:36 PM]GMaia: In the whole game there are 4 concepts which are both the base for the divine spells, the arcane ones and the moral alignments
@Dan the GMshoeDoes each caster only know one element and one principle?[1:37 PM]GMaia: No, he can decide to learn as much as his capabilites allow
[1:37 PM]GMaia: The knowledge of these words is rules like a skill
[1:37 PM]GMaia: You spend 1 point in it and you have level 1 of knowledge in that word
[1:38 PM]GMaia: The more intelligent a character is, the higher is the nr of points to be allocated in magic words
[1:38 PM]GMaia: Similarly It works for divine spell where a character has to allocate points to a prayer which produces magical effects
[1:39 PM]Dan the GMshoe: Can you give us an example of a really high-level effect possible with divine and arcane magic?1
[1:39 PM]GMaia: Another difference is that divine magic affects only living beings, wheras arcane works in any way
@Dan the GMshoeCan you give us an example of a really high-level effect possible with divine and arcane magic?[1:41 PM]GMaia: For arcane magic everyone can choose any effect he wants! There is not a strict list of words, the GM may allow any words a player asks
[1:42 PM]GMaia: There is a drawback though: if a character defines a too powerful effect, in case it goes beyond a certain threshold, it will produce a backfire
[1:43 PM]GMaia: And considering that damages in this game directly lower the stat of the character, it is possible to die …
[1:44 PM]GMaia: I conceived this framework with no constraints: there are lists of words, there is not a max nr of spells per day, there is not a true definition of what a caster can do
[1:44 PM]GMaia: The main contraint is that in case a character wants too much from his magic powers, he could really have serious problems
[1:45 PM]GMaia: Therefore a high-level effect could be a kind of thermal spear which melts down stone… this could come with a cost however…
[1:46 PM]GMaia: And here we get to the KUP!
[1:47 PM]GMaia: the player doesn’t know all the stats of his player, he knows the main stat and the level of the skill he is using
[1:47 PM]GMaia: He doesn’t know a stat which lies in between of these
[1:47 PM]GMaia: This chart helps to explain this:
[1:48 PM]GMaia: This is the 3-level framework I built to define a character
[1:49 PM]GMaia: The player know the score of the ‘known stat’ (KS) and the score of the ‘exclusive skill’ (ES)
[1:49 PM]GMaia: He doesn’t know the score in his ‘unknown stat’ (US)
[1:49 PM]GMaia: This info is in the hands of the GM
[1:49 PM]Dan the GMshoe: What’s the thinking behind that?
[1:50 PM]GMaia: On this topic we can spend days! Let me summarize it with some ver short thoughts:
[1:50 PM]GMaia: 1. I wanted a game where players do not perfom calculations for game mechanics applications in advance
[1:51 PM]GMaia: 2. I wanted a game where players among their goals there is also the one of ‘know yourself’ (with time and excercise)
[1:52 PM]GMaia: 3. I wanted a game where the boring calculations are up to the GM and the true play (i.e. roleplay) is up to the players
[1:53 PM]GMaia: 4. The uncertainity of this kind is somehow a positive element for those players who are looking for ‘search and discovery’
[1:54 PM]GMaia: If you look at the chart, there are 2 ‘unknonw stats’ which are disabled…
[1:54 PM]GMaia: This is an additional element I added to the rules in order to foster the roleplay
[1:55 PM]GMaia: These stats will never be used within game mechanics, they will always be solved by players with roleplay (and their own capabilites)
[1:56 PM]GMaia: There will never be an occasion where a player who is not able to work out a riddle will ask the GM to roll his PC Intelligence
[1:56 PM]GMaia: the same as for charisma
[1:56 PM]GMaia: (sorry I use the D&D terms to better explain them…)
[1:57 PM]Dan the GMshoe: No problem!
[1:57 PM]Dan the GMshoe: Do you have a character sheet that we can see?
[1:57 PM]GMaia: Sure! As you wrote, I prepared some pics!
[1:58 PM]GMaia: there are actually 2 char sheets, one for the player and one for the GM were he keeps track of any piece of info which is not allowed to the player
[1:58 PM]GMaia: This one is the player sheet:
[1:59 PM]GMaia: The GM sheet of the same player will integrate it with the ‘hidden info’:
[2:00 PM]Dan the GMshoe: Can you describe the task resolution mechanic?1
[2:00 PM]GMaia: Before we move into this topic, let me add a detail I have always asked to an RPG and never find
[2:01 PM]GMaia: The char sheet is not a sheet! It is a booklet so that a player can write everything about the campaign, not only the PC stats… I always found uncomfortable with many pages stapled together …
@Dan the GMshoeCan you describe the task resolution mechanic?[2:02 PM]GMaia: Sure, I called it ARC, Action Resolution Check1
[2:03 PM]GMaia: It is important to say in advance that this mechanic is used for every check: combat, non-combat and spellcasting
[2:03 PM]GMaia: Here we go:
[2:04 PM]GMaia: Directly from the pages of the book!
[2:05 PM]GMaia: The action is a check where ‘known stat’ and ‘unknonw stat’ are added… there is a third addend: the result of a die based on the skill used
[2:05 PM]GMaia: the higher the score, the larger the nr of faces of the die and the max result
[2:06 PM]GMaia: The result of this roll works this way: if you get any result equal or lower of the score in the skill used, you add this result to the KS+US
[2:07 PM]GMaia: If you roll over your score you are eligilble for a malus (=penalty)
[2:07 PM]GMaia: You have to confirm it with a second roll… and if your score is not enough high you can roll again for a higher penalty… this up to -3
[2:10 PM]GMaia: In a nutshell: a player with an average known stat (KS=6), with a good level of excercise (US=4) and a score in a skill of 4 has the following potential outcome:
[2:10 PM]GMaia: 6+4+ 1d6
[2:10 PM]GMaia: if the result is 1,2,3,4 then the outcome is 11-14
[2:11 PM]GMaia: if the roll is 5 or 6 (and it is confirmed) the outcome is 9
[2:11 PM]GMaia: …or 8 if he doesn’t confirm for two time in a row
[2:13 PM]GMaia: The ARC can be vs opponent: in this case two ARC are compared and if a character wants to succeed, he has to get a higher result of the other ARC (like for combat: one attacks with an ARC and another defends with another ARC)
[2:14 PM]Dan the GMshoe: So you want to roll as high as possible without going over the skill score?
[2:14 PM]GMaia: The ARC can be vs a threshold: the result has to be higher than a fixed value (like for hide: the player rolls against a value)
@Dan the GMshoeSo you want to roll as high as possible without going over the skill score?[2:14 PM]GMaia: Yes
[2:14 PM]GMaia: Every stat has a score between 1 and 10
[2:15 PM]Dan the GMshoe: How are the unknown scores figured at character creation?
[2:15 PM]GMaia: All the US starts with a score of 1.
[2:15 PM]GMaia: they can grow under a circumstance: a score in a skill related to that US grows
[2:16 PM]GMaia: In this case the GM rolls to determine whether or not the relative US has increased by 1
[2:17 PM]GMaia: The % of probability goes from 50% when the ES score goes from 1 to 2 down to 5% when the score increases from 9 to 10
[2:18 PM]GMaia: The player in this way is never sure of his US, he has to check it during game… and the exciting side of this mechanic is that the more you use the skill to understand your character’s limit, the higher is the probability that the US will increase more and more…
[2:19 PM]GMaia: This is what I call KUP: keep uneducated players (I know it is not grammatically correct but i like this saying! Apologies!)2
[2:21 PM]GMaia: If I may add, along with the unknown stats and the spellcasting, there are two other main pillars of this KUP model within the game: Morality and character progression…1
[2:22 PM]Dan the GMshoe: Yes, do go on!
[2:22 PM]GMaia: Thanks! First growth!
[2:24 PM]GMaia: A character has tow two ways to improve… one is trivial: the GM defines a rule which allows to increase a score in a skill if he uses it in the proper way… for instance: the nr of successes in a row. If a character reaches a threshold, his skill will increase.
[2:25 PM]GMaia: The second way is by reaching a certain amount of growth point (i.e. xp). These points are gained in two ways:
[2:25 PM]GMaia: 1. by reaching targets set by the GM in terms of roleplay or plot development (similar to the tournament mechanic)
[2:26 PM]GMaia: 2. by guessing if his character will succeed or not in an ARC
[2:27 PM]GMaia: when the GM deems it correct, he will ask the player to guess the outcome of the upcoming result in an ARC of his character
[2:28 PM]GMaia: The player will get points (even negative) according to the table here above: if he calls a success and the ARC is a success, then he will gain +2 xp … and so forth!
[2:29 PM]GMaia: Therefore the progression is not tied to kills, treasures or other similar targets, but to the degree of acquaintance the players has with his PC.
[2:29 PM]GMaia: This brings to the moral alignment!
[2:29 PM]GMaia: (it seems weird, but it is!)
[2:30 PM]GMaia: The morality affects the threshold of points a character needs to achieve to level up.
[2:30 PM]GMaia: The morality is not an indication, it is a stat.
[2:31 PM]GMaia: It has a score (unknown to the player) which is affected by the actions the character undertakes.
[2:32 PM]GMaia: this score (called Morality index) lowers or increases the total amount of points needed for the next level.
[2:32 PM]GMaia: Now, the Morality: this is a feature extremely important for this game.
[2:33 PM]GMaia: A player has to define one Path for his character at the creation,.
[2:33 PM]GMaia: The Paths are similar to the D&D aligments in terms of concept, their definition is not the same though!
[2:35 PM]GMaia: I used the very wise definition of Carlo Cipolla (if you don’t know him, I do reccomend his essay on the Human stupidity!)
[2:36 PM]GMaia: Once a character has a Path defined according to the simple and effective definitions of Cipolla, he starts in a position within the selected quadrant
[2:36 PM]GMaia: His starting point is 2, 2 (the quadrant is 5X5)
[2:36 PM]GMaia: The max he can attain is 5, 5
[2:36 PM]GMaia: The lowest score is 0,0
[2:37 PM]GMaia: Ha can even move to another Path if he keeps behaving in the ‘wrong’ way….
[2:38 PM]GMaia: For every step towards the ‘holiness’ (5,5), the Morality index increases by 1 point. Therefore in the position 5,5 the index is +6, while in 0,0 the index is -4.
[2:39 PM]GMaia: The GM sheet helps to better understand
[2:39 PM]GMaia: The more a character sticks to his Path, the easier is the access to higher levels.
[2:40 PM]GMaia: This is a prize to those who seriously consider the alignment within the game
[2:41 PM]GMaia: And btw, this was an original idea by Gary Gygax!!1
[2:41 PM]Dan the GMshoe: Sorry, phone
[2:41 PM]Dan the GMshoe: (A good friend’s brother just died. )
@Dan the GMshoeSorry, phone[2:41 PM]GMaia: Don’t worry!
[2:41 PM]GMaia: My condolescences.
[2:42 PM]GMaia: Do you want to go ahead? I feel it would not be the right thing…
[2:44 PM]Dan the GMshoe: (I do. Give me just a bit.)
[2:45 PM]GMaia: Frankly speaking, I don’t think it’d be correct…
[2:45 PM]GMaia: Do not worry, there are only 15 mins left… we can stop here.
[2:45 PM]Dan the GMshoe: Okay, man. I appreciate it. Is there anything we haven’t covered that you’d like to bring up?
[2:46 PM]GMaia: Well, this question is nasty for an enthusiastic author at his first work!
[2:47 PM]GMaia: The main points have been covered…
[2:47 PM]GMaia: Hi have a blog with several ‘Deep dives’ which further explains the game
[2:48 PM]Dan the GMshoe: Feel free to post it!
[2:48 PM]GMaia: And in that blog there are also some interesting readings: from some thoughs on RPG industry
[2:48 PM]GMaia: …up to the purpose of the game and personal goals!
[2:49 PM]GMaia: HEre wa have the ‘deep dives’:
[2:49 PM]GMaia: https://6810kuprpg.blogspot.com/search/label/Deep%20diveVI·VIII·X KUP RPGTAGS: VI.VIII.X VIVIIIX 6.8.10 6810 FANTASY KUP RPG ROLE-PLAYING KNIGHT OF THE LAKE PROUDTS GMAIA
[2:49 PM]GMaia: Here we have the thoughts on the KUP model:
[2:50 PM]GMaia: https://6810kuprpg.blogspot.com/2022/03/the-concept-of-kup-rpg-part-1.htmlThe concept of KUP RPG (part 1)TAGS: VI.VIII.X VIVIIIX 6.8.10 6810 FANTASY KUP RPG ROLE-PLAYING KNIGHT OF THE LAKE PROUDTS GMAIA
[2:50 PM]GMaia: https://6810kuprpg.blogspot.com/2022/03/the-concept-of-kup-rpg-part-2.htmlThe concept of KUP RPG (part 2)TAGS: VI.VIII.X VIVIIIX 6.8.10 6810 FANTASY KUP RPG ROLE-PLAYING KNIGHT OF THE LAKE PROUDTS GMAIA
[2:50 PM]GMaia: Here we have some other (hopefully) good readings:
[2:51 PM]GMaia: https://6810kuprpg.blogspot.com/2023/01/someone-got-ahead-of-me-let-me.htmlSomeone got ahead of me… let me introduce mr Sandy Eisen!TAGS: VI.VIII.X VIVIIIX 6.8.10 6810 FANTASY KUP RPG ROLE-PLAYING KNIGHT OF THE LAKE PROUDTS GMAIA
[2:51 PM]GMaia: https://6810kuprpg.blogspot.com/2023/02/original-concept-of-alignment-vs.htmlOriginal concept of Alignment vs Morality in VI·VIII·XTAGS: VI.VIII.X VIVIIIX 6.8.10 6810 FANTASY KUP RPG ROLE-PLAYING KNIGHT OF THE LAKE PROUDTS GMAIA
[2:52 PM]GMaia: I could post other links, but I think that if anyone is interested, then he/she is more than welcome and visit my blog!!
[2:53 PM]Dan the GMshoe: Thanks very much for joining us, @GMaia!
[2:53 PM]Dan the GMshoe: Usual reminder: If you’ve enjoyed this Q&A and would like to treat me to a coffee or two, you can do so at https://www.ko-fi.com/gmshoe. Anything’s appreciated! Ko-fiBuy Dan Davenport a Coffee. ko-fi.com/gmshoeBecome a supporter of Dan Davenport today! ❤️ Ko-fi lets you support the creators you love with no fees on donations.
[2:53 PM]GMaia: Thanks to you, Dan!
[2:53 PM]Dan the GMshoe: If you’ll give me a minute, I’ll get the log posted and link you!
[2:54 PM]GMaia: It has been really a pleause!
Message #q-and-a