[19:02] <+blackhatmatt> My name is Matthew “BlackHat Matt” McFarland
[19:02] <+blackhatmatt> I’m a game developer and writer (and an SLP in my day job), I live in Cleveland, OH
[19:02] <@Silverlion> SLP? Solitary Laser Patrol?
[19:03] <+blackhatmatt> Speech-Language Pathologist
[19:03] <+blackhatmatt> My wife, Michelle Lyons-McFarland, and I own Growling Door Games, Inc.
[19:03] <@Silverlion> Oh awesome day job.
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[19:03] <+blackhatmatt> And a few months ago, we made arrangements with Martin Caron to make a new edition of the Chill roleplaying game!
[19:03] <~Dan> (Welcome to #rpgnet, MichelleL-M!)
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[19:04] <+blackhatmatt> So, let’s talk about Chill
[19:04] <+blackhatmatt> Chill is a horror RPG, originally published by Pacesetter Games (1984) and then Mayfair Games (1990)
[19:05] <+blackhatmatt> The various editions have some differences, but they have this in common:
[19:05] <+blackhatmatt> PCs are members of an organization called SAVE (The Eternal Society of the Silver Way)
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[19:05] <+blackhatmatt> SAVE is dedicated to investigating and combating the Unknown
[19:06] <+blackhatmatt> It’s not exactly a fair fight; the Unknown is rapacious, relentless, and feeds on human misery and fear
[19:06] <+blackhatmatt> (And sometimes more basic stuff, like blood and flesh)
[19:06] <+blackhatmatt> But SAVE keeps at it, through decades – centuries – of setbacks and attrition
[19:07] <+blackhatmatt> Because it’s composed of the kind of people who, when they see that kind of evil, stand up
[19:07] <+blackhatmatt> That is, my favorite kind of people. π
[19:07] <~Dan> π
[19:07] <+blackhatmatt> So! Hit with some questions, y’all
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[19:08] <~Dan> Thanks, blackhatmatt! The floor is open to questions!
[19:08] <~Dan> Can you give us an overview of what’s new about 3e?
[19:08] <+blackhatmatt> Sure!
[19:09] <+blackhatmatt> So, the system remains percentile, but we’ve stripped out a lot of the unnecessary stuff
[19:09] <+blackhatmatt> 90s game design tended to include a lot of sub-systems that, at the end of the day, you didn’t really need
[19:10] <+blackhatmatt> My sensibilities as a game designer are more of the indie school, but I came up playing TSR’s Marvel Superheroes, Chill 2nd Ed, World of Darkness…
[19:10] <+blackhatmatt> And kind of slid into Fate, Gumshoe, Apocalypse World, and obviously NWoD
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[19:10] <+blackhatmatt> So all of these things inform our approach to Chill 3rd
[19:11] <~Dan> (Welcome to #rpgnet, Guest27! Please set your name with the /nick command. π )
[19:11] <+blackhatmatt> Which is a long-winded way of saying that the underlying system will feel familiar to Chill players, but there’s less math and it works more smoothly
[19:11] <+blackhatmatt> More specifically!
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[19:12] <+Jonathan_FIK> What are you looking forward to the most in this new edition?
[19:12] <+blackhatmatt> In addition to the dice system (percentile, roll low) we have a token system. A game table will have X tokens (number of players, including the Chill Master, +1)
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[19:12] <+blackhatmatt> And they get flipped between light and dark
[19:13] <+blackhatmatt> Players can flip a chip dark to add to their target numbers (before or after a roll), to make use of certain Disciplines of the Art, and, in really dire straits, to save a character’s life
[19:13] <+jcftao> So, the resolution table is no longer needed?
[19:13] <+blackhatmatt> They *have* to flip a chip dark if they botch a roll, but flip one light if they get a colossal success
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[19:14] <+blackhatmatt> The CM flips a chip light to boost NPCs rolls similarly, but creatures of the Unknown use the chips to activate their evil powers
[19:14] <+jcftao> I played Chill 1st ed back in college and it was one of my favorite games.
[19:14] <+blackhatmatt> The really nasty ones *add* a light chip to the table
[19:14] <+blackhatmatt> jcftao: No resolution table needed
[19:14] <+blackhatmatt> The hardest math in the game is “divide a number by 2”
[19:15] <@Silverlion> How simple are characters to make in this edition?
[19:15] <~Dan> (Question pause, please.)
[19:15] <+BlasterKyubey210> Oooh fun
[19:15] <+blackhatmatt> OK, moving on to Jonathan_FIK question about what I’m looking forward to
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[19:15] <+blackhatmatt> SAVE!
[19:15] <+blackhatmatt> I’ve always loved SAVE, and I always felt like Chill didn’t give enough attention to the organization and how it works
[19:16] <+blackhatmatt> Now, Chill 2nd Ed provided some SAVE history up to 1990, but it’s 2014 now (in case you’ve had a *really* long day and forgot)
[19:16] <@Silverlion> I love SAVE.
[19:16] <+blackhatmatt> By the time the book comes out (GenCon 2015), that’s 25 years of history to consider
[19:16] <+blackhatmatt> And SAVE has had a rough time of it
[19:16] <+blackhatmatt> They’ve dealt with infiltration and high attrition
[19:16] <+blackhatmatt> And regional HQs not knowing who to trust
[19:17] <+blackhatmatt> But then they got a new leader – a woman who has fought this kind of war before and was able to help SAVE refocus and reformat itself
[19:17] <+blackhatmatt> So, in Chill 3rd, we’re including a section for groups to build their local SAVE HQ
[19:17] <+blackhatmatt> You want SAVE to be able to swoop in with reinforcements if you call for them? Fine.
[19:18] <+blackhatmatt> You want SAVE to be basically a dozen folks meeting at Panera every month? Also fine
[19:19] <+blackhatmatt> OK, moving to Silverlion’s question about chargen
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[19:19] <+blackhatmatt> There’s still some math involved, but not as much – some of the derived traits are averages of attributes
[19:19] <+blackhatmatt> But it’s not as number-crunchy as 2nd Ed
[19:20] <+blackhatmatt> The book will also include some pregens and some templates, so if you’d rather say “I want to play an anthropologist,” bam, grab that template, add Edges and Drawbacks or maybe some training in the Art, and you’re good to go
[19:20] <+blackhatmatt> Next question!
[19:20] <@Silverlion> Awesome.
[19:20] <@Silverlion> Are you doing color art this time around?
[19:20] * +Kage2020 contented sigh of the mention of anthropologists (what is it about horror games that requires anthropologists and archaeologists!). π
[19:21] <@Silverlion> Horrors of the unknown and the alien
[19:21] <+blackhatmatt> Kage2020: I mentioned that because Eddy Webb, who’s writing the character creation and traits chapter, used that as an example of a template he’s writing
[19:21] <+zorm> will there be rules to play kid characters included in the core book or in a later book
[19:21] <+blackhatmatt> Silverlion: Color, yes. The pdf will be in full color
[19:21] <+blackhatmatt> The hardcover will be in color if we make our first stretch goal
[19:22] <+blackhatmatt> Which is $29000
[19:22] <+blackhatmatt> So totally doable
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[19:22] <+blackhatmatt> zorm: Not in the core book, *maybe* in a later book
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[19:22] <+blackhatmatt> We have plans for a book on SAVE, and that might be a good place fo rit
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[19:22] <~Dan> blackhatmatt: Do you have a character sheet mockup, by any chance?
[19:23] <+blackhatmatt> The system is pretty brutal, and that’s not a good mesh with child characters – kids getting hurt is kind of a sensitive spot for me personally (I work in an inner city elementary school)
[19:23] <+blackhatmatt> So I’m not sure it would be my first choice for *Chill*
[19:23] <+blackhatmatt> But I do like a challange
[19:24] <+blackhatmatt> Dan: I don’t have a blank character sheet, sadly. Backers of the KS get a quickstart, which has 5 pregens (with original art, which is gorgeous)
[19:24] <+blackhatmatt> But we just changed some skill things around, and I knew we were doing that, so I haven’t had Thomas make a blank yet
[19:24] <+blackhatmatt> But that’s very much on my agenda
[19:24] <~Dan> blackhatmatt: No worries. I just find having one to look at can help guide the discussion of the system.
[19:25] <+blackhatmatt> I have a spreadsheet that has all the trait names, but, like, it’s a spreadsheet. I can link it if folks want, though
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[19:25] <~Dan> blackhatmatt: Can you tell us what the attributes are and how they relate to skills?
[19:25] <~Dan> (Welcome to #rpgnet, Guest38! Please set your name with the /nick command. π )
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[19:26] <+blackhatmatt> Dan: Sure!
[19:26] <~Dan> (Thanks, Jerry! Here for the Q&A?)
[19:26] <+Jerry> Yep!
[19:26] <+blackhatmatt> You’ve got six attributes: Agility, Dexterity, Focus, Perception, Personality, Strength
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[19:26] <+Geek2theRight> As someone unfamiliar with earlier editions of Chill, and who backed both CtD and Ti5A, I’m curious if the new edition of Chill is going to be a smaller, narrower in scope game like your previous stuff, or if it’s going to be a larger, more normal(well, average)-in-size-and-scope RPG.
[19:26] <~Dan> (In progress! Pull up a virtual chair and ask questions as yo like. π )
[19:26] <+blackhatmatt> And then three traits derived from those: Stamina, Willpower, and Reflexes
[19:26] <~Dan> (Welcome to #rpgnet, Guest35! Please set your name with the /nick command. π )
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[19:27] <+blackhatmatt> Each of the those 9 traits has an attached skill
[19:27] <~Dan> A single skill?
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[19:27] <+blackhatmatt> Which are: Movement, Field Mechanics, Research, Investigation, Communication, Prowess, Close Quarters Combat, Interview, and Ranged Combat, respectively
[19:27] <~Dan> (Thanks, menlow! If you are here for the Q&A, it’s in progress, and the floor is open to questions!)
[19:28] <+blackhatmatt> Yep, one skill. Those skills can either be trained or untrained. If you’re trained, your score is equal to the controlling attribute. If it’s untrained, it’s half that attribute (with the exception of Interview and CQQ, so stick a pin in those for now)
[19:28] <+blackhatmatt> If you’re trained in a skill, you can take specialties
[19:29] <+Jerry> How do you determine attributes?
[19:29] <+blackhatmatt> So if I’m trained in Research, I can specialize in Computer, and add 10 (Beginner), 25 (Expert) or 50 (Master) to my score
[19:29] <+Geek2theRight> In spite of my earlier statement ending with a period, there was a bit of a question in there. ^^;
[19:29] <~Dan> Sorry — what attributes govern Close Quarters and Ranged Combat?
[19:30] <+blackhatmatt> Geek2theRight: Chill is much more like a traditional RPG than Growling Door’s other projects, but my indie sensibilities creep in. π
[19:30] <+jcftao> Will there be options to play in different eras? Chill 1st had the late 1800’s I believe?
[19:30] <+blackhatmatt> (Hang on, Dan, I’ll be right back to that. :))
[19:30] <~Dan> (Question pause.)
[19:30] <@Silverlion> that’s cool. I like that things go a little indie, but not too indie….
[19:30] <~Dan> (No problem, blackhatmatt. π )
[19:31] <+blackhatmatt> For instance, creatures’ attributes are shaved down. They don’t have the same attributes as envoys. They have Attack, Stamina, Reflexes, and Evil Way Score. Then they have Disciplines (nasty powers)
[19:31] <+blackhatmatt> And Aspects (things like “can act twice a turn” and “suffers damage from silver only”)
[19:32] <+blackhatmatt> OK, back to Dan: Close Quarters Combat is linked to Stamina, but Stamina fluxes as you get hurt or tired
[19:32] <+blackhatmatt> If you’re trained, that’s fine, your score is your max (because you’re going on muscle memory)
[19:32] <+blackhatmatt> If you’re not trained, your CQC score is your current Stamina
[19:32] <+blackhatmatt> Ranged Combat is equal to Reflexes; that doesn’t diminish
[19:33] <~Dan> And what attributes go into Stamina and Reflexes?
[19:33] <+blackhatmatt> Interview is linked to Willpower, which, like Stamina, can drop, meaning if you’re exhausted your ability to get information out of people is going to suck
[19:33] <+blackhatmatt> Stamina is the average of Agility and Strength, Reflexes is Dexterity and Perception, and Willpower is Focus and Pesonality
[19:34] <~Dan> Hmm. Reasonable enough.
[19:34] <+blackhatmatt> Am I caught up? Hang on…
[19:34] <+blackhatmatt> Oh, wait, Jerry asked about determining attributes
[19:34] <+blackhatmatt> When you make a character, you’ve got three choices:
[19:35] <+blackhatmatt> Pick a pregen and tweak whatever you like
[19:35] <+blackhatmatt> Pick a template and add the traits that aren’t there (attributes and skills are done, but Edges and Drawbacks aren’t)
[19:35] <+blackhatmatt> Or build the character from scratch, which is on a point-buy
[19:36] <+Jerry> Thanks! I know in 2e it was difficult (I thought) to do all the math to determine degree of success, how is that done in 3e?
[19:36] <+blackhatmatt> I personally like that last method, but I have players who would much rather not muck about with the attributes
[19:37] <+blackhatmatt> In 3rd ed, you still have general checks (roll under your target number, and you succeed, it’s just pass/fail) and specific checks
[19:37] <+blackhatmatt> Specific checks have 5 degrees of success: botch, fail, low success, high success, colossal success
[19:37] <+blackhatmatt> You get a low success if you roll under your target number, but more than half
[19:37] <+blackhatmatt> You get a high if you roll less than half your target number
[19:38] <+blackhatmatt> You botch if you fail and roll doubles
[19:38] <+blackhatmatt> You get a colossal success if you succeed and roll doubles
[19:38] <~Dan> That’s nice and elegant.
[19:38] <+Jerry> That’s definitely simpler
[19:38] <+blackhatmatt> It’s worked really well in playtest
[19:38] <+blackhatmatt> And it’s fun watch people’s faces when they roll doubles
[19:39] <+blackhatmatt> OK, next question!
[19:39] <+menlow> Is there a rule built into 3e to sort of “take ten” on a skill that a player is super proficient in, or will that have to be a house rule? I was always frustrated when I failed a check in something that should’ve been simple for my character
[19:39] <+blackhatmatt> Ooh, good question
[19:40] <+blackhatmatt> So, some of this comes down to CM style. If something should be simple for your character and time isn’t a factor, I probably won’t make you roll (and I’m sure Jonathan Lavallee, who’s writing the CM section, will point that out)
[19:40] <+Jerry> Ok, now the hardball question. We have 1e via Cryptworld, and 2e is still sold in PDF form. If you could summarize in a sentence or two (or three?) why buy into 3e?
[19:40] <+blackhatmatt> You can flip a chip to add to your target number after you roll, which can make the difference in close cases
[19:41] <+blackhatmatt> There’s not a “take 10” mechanic as it stands, but I’ll make note of that and bring it up as we playtest. Thanks!
[19:41] <+menlow> Sure, thank you
[19:42] <~Dan> (Quick aside: Adding a name after “Chill Master” makes a person sound like a rap star.)
[19:42] <~Dan> (Chill Master Dan, yo.)
[19:42] <+blackhatmatt> Jerry: Because 3e keeps the stuff that was awesome about Chill and streamlines the clunky stuff. Because we added more focus on SAVE and more exploration of their struggle and their heroism.
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[19:43] <+blackhatmatt> Because horror is about risk and loss and tension, and we’ve got a crew of writers who know how to bring that out
[19:43] <+Jerry> Fair enough, I know it’s not a simple question.
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[19:44] <+Jerry> You certainly do have a lot of great talen involved
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[19:44] <+blackhatmatt> (I know, and I hate answering questions like that. I always want to say “Come to my house and play it! You’ll see!” But that’s not practical. π )
[19:44] <~Dan> (Howdy, Papermonkey!)
[19:44] <+Papermonkey> *sees blackhatmatt’s user name*
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[19:44] <+jcftao> Any options to play in older eras? 1920’s or earlier?
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[19:44] <+Papermonkey> :0 I recognize that name but do not know from where
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[19:45] <~Dan> Does Strength affect damage, or does it just affect the chanct to hit by way of Stamina?
[19:45] <~Dan> Papermonkey: Look at the chat topic. π
[19:45] <+Jerry> Got to bow out, but good luck with the Kickstarter! You’ll beat your goal I’m sure.
[19:45] <~Dan> Bye, Jerry!
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[19:46] <+Papermonkey> oho
[19:46] <+blackhatmatt> Dan: Strength doesn’t affect damage. Training in CQC *can*, because you can use combat techniques
[19:46] <+blackhatmatt> But damage isn’t figure like 2nd Ed, where everything had a strike rank and there were lots of numbers
[19:46] * ~Dan nods
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[19:47] <+blackhatmatt> So, everything that does damage does one of six kinds of injury (Superficial, Minor, Serious, Critical, Lethal, Catastrophic)
[19:47] <~Dan> On the monster side of the equation, can the system handle strong-but-clumsy creatures?
[19:47] <~Dan> (Howdy, Monochrome_Tide!)
[19:47] <+blackhatmatt> Injurious things are rated by what damage they do on a low success
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[19:48] <+blackhatmatt> So punching someone does Superficial by default, but if I get a high success I do Minor, if I get a colossal success I do Serious
[19:48] * ~Dan nods
[19:48] <+blackhatmatt> (High is +1, colossal is +2)
[19:48] <+blackhatmatt> It’s really, really easy to die in Chill
[19:48] <+blackhatmatt> You need to have your team withyou
[19:48] <+blackhatmatt> You need to do your research before you jump into a fight
[19:49] <+blackhatmatt> jctao asked about playing in historical eras, and I want to answer that real quick
[19:49] <+blackhatmatt> jcftao, sorry
[19:49] <+blackhatmatt> Missed a letter
[19:49] <+blackhatmatt> The answer is: Not in the core book
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[19:50] <+blackhatmatt> Might be something we do later if there’s interest. That said, it wouldn’t be hard to run a game set in the 20s with the existing system
[19:50] <+blackhatmatt> Mostly it’d be a matter of taking appropriate specialties for your skills, I think
[19:50] <+jcftao> sure
[19:50] <+blackhatmatt> OK, Dan asked about big clumsy creatures
[19:50] <+blackhatmatt> Sure, the system could handle it
[19:51] <+blackhatmatt> You’d just have a creature with a low Reflexes score, maybe a low Attack score, but that inflicts Serious or even Critical (oof) Injury by default
[19:51] <+blackhatmatt> Meaning it won’t hit you easily, but if it does, you’re kinda SOL
[19:51] * ~Dan nods
[19:51] <+blackhatmatt> Next question!
[19:51] <+menlow> Will there be stats for “classic” monsters (e.g. Dracula) in the core rulebook?
[19:52] <+Martin> I’m Martin, Chill owner, and I wanna say I really like what Matthew is doing with Chill.
[19:52] <+blackhatmatt> I think Danielle (Lauzon, who’s writing the creatures) did in fact mention Dracula. π
[19:52] <~Dan> On a related note, to clarify something we discussed pre-Q&A: I take it that weapons will have actual damage ratings?
[19:52] <+blackhatmatt> But the draft is due Monday
[19:53] <+blackhatmatt> Dan: Weapons inflict Minor, Serious, or Critical (for the really nasty ones) by default
[19:53] * ~Dan nods
[19:53] <+blackhatmatt> I’ve never been a fan of granular weapons tables; I don’t think they add much to the game
[19:53] <+blackhatmatt> And our Injury system is meant to model horror-story lethality. That is, get hit and you’re gonna feel it
[19:53] <+blackhatmatt> Guns kill quickly
[19:53] <~Dan> I’m not too worried about that, myself. I just hated the fact that in Chill 1e, it didn’t matter if you were using a toothpick or a claymore.
[19:54] <+blackhatmatt> Actually, my brother (who is writing up the core systems, like combat and investigation) mentioned that it was maybe a little unrealistically deadly – he’s a cop and has seen people take lots of bullets before falling down
[19:54] <+blackhatmatt> Thanks, Martin!
[19:54] <+blackhatmatt> Doing Chill is really a dream come true, and I have to thank Martin for giving us this chance. π
[19:54] <+blackhatmatt> Next question!
[19:55] <+jcftao> Can players hope for some character advancement…or are the envoys doomed to spend their last days in the asylum?
[19:55] <~Dan> Ooooh, Martin is the owner of the Chill license?
[19:55] <+blackhatmatt> jcftao: Great question!
[19:55] <+blackhatmatt> Dan: Martin owns the Chill IP
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[19:55] <+blackhatmatt> Growling Door licensed it
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[19:56] <~Dan> Cool! It’s a pleasure to have you here, Martin!
[19:56] <+blackhatmatt> But, back to jcftao’s question
[19:56] <~Dan> (Welcome to #rpgnet, Guest91 and Guest07! Please set your names with the /nick command. π )
[19:56] <+blackhatmatt> Envoys can definitely advance. This isn’t Call of Cthulhu, and thematically the game isn’t about the inevitable spiral into madness
[19:57] <+blackhatmatt> We’re experimenting with our healing systems, and how envoys can heal Injury and Trauma and Shock – we don’t want it to be a matter of quaffing a bunch of healing potions
[19:57] <+Martin> Thank you Dan.
[19:57] <+blackhatmatt> One thing one of our writers suggested was making multiple envoys for your SAVE HQ, so that if one character gets injured or badly traumatized, you can play another while the first is healing up
[19:58] <+blackhatmatt> We’re playing with that; we’ll see how it works in playtest
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[19:58] <~Dan> (Welcome to #rpgnet, Bogus! Here for the Q&A? π )
[19:59] <+Bogus> Yup. I’m excited for the game and to learn more
[19:59] <+blackhatmatt> But the themes of the game are more about investigation, standing up to the Unknown even when you know it’s unwise, and protecting people rather than the kind of “I know this is going to screw me but I can’t look away” that you find in Mythos-based games
[19:59] <+blackhatmatt> Not that there’s anything wrong with that; Trail of Cthulhu is one of my favorite horror game
[19:59] <+blackhatmatt> *games
[19:59] <+blackhatmatt> But it’s not what we’re doing here
[19:59] <+blackhatmatt> Next!
[19:59] <~Dan> Can you say a bit about the Art and any changes to it in 3e?
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[20:00] <+blackhatmatt> Dan: Ooh, I was hoping you’d ask. π
[20:00] <+blackhatmatt> We added 2 Schools of the Art.
[20:00] <+blackhatmatt> Each of the six attributes has a linked School
[20:00] <+Kage2020> blackhatmatt: Is that what you think that makes Chill (and more specifically Chill 3e) stand out as a game? (“But the themes of the game are more investigation…” etc.)
[20:00] <+blackhatmatt> So: Agility = Incorporeal (astral projection, attacking ghosts)
[20:01] <+blackhatmatt> Dexterity = Kinetic (psychometry, low-grade TK, still playing with that one)
[20:01] <+blackhatmatt> Focus = Protective (mental shield, repelling the Evil Way)
[20:01] <+blackhatmatt> Perception = Sensing (Premonition, Postcognition)
[20:01] <+blackhatmatt> Personality = Communicative (Prescient Dreams, telepathy)
[20:02] <+blackhatmatt> Strength = Restorative (healing)
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[20:03] <+blackhatmatt> Oh, also!
[20:03] <+blackhatmatt> If you want to use a School, you’re trained in it, just like a skill
[20:03] <+blackhatmatt> If you’re trained, you have a minor power you can use by flipping a chip
[20:04] <+blackhatmatt> So for instance, if I’m trained in Protective, I can flip a chip to give someone affected by the Evil Way a turn of freedom
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[20:04] <+blackhatmatt> Which is enough for them to scream “For god’s sake help me!” before the possession sets in again, but maybe answer a question, too
[20:04] <+blackhatmatt> And then Disciplines act like specialties to that training
[20:04] <+blackhatmatt> Next question!
[20:04] <+jcftao> I’ve often thought of Chill 1st edition in terms of the Hammer horror films. What horror movies have influenced your vision of Chill 3rd edition?
[20:04] <+menlow> Is it still feasible to have a character that has no skills in the Art?
[20:05] <~Dan> (Kage2020 had a question back there, blackhatmatt.)
[20:05] <+blackhatmatt> I’ll answer menlow first because that’s easier: Yes
[20:05] <+blackhatmatt> One of the characters in the QS doesn’t, and she doesn’t feel underpowered or anything
[20:05] <+blackhatmatt> Oh, whoops
[20:05] <+blackhatmatt> Kage2020: Yes, and also the focus on the humanist elements
[20:05] <+blackhatmatt> SAVE envoys are normal people. That’s what I’ve always loved about them
[20:06] <+menlow> Right, me too. Awesome. Thanks
[20:06] <+blackhatmatt> They fight the Unknown because if they don’t, then who will?
[20:06] <+blackhatmatt> There are people in the world who, when they see evil, stand up, because they can’t not
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[20:07] <~Dan> blackhatmatt: Again, this is something we discussed pre-Q&A, but can you say a bit about how the Evil Way has changed for 3e?
[20:07] <+blackhatmatt> That doesn’t mean they aren’t flawed or scared or hurt, but it means they’re heroes in a way that the more idealized, fantastical characters of other games can’t be
[20:07] <~Dan> (Welcome to #rpgnet, Neal5x5!)
[20:07] <+blackhatmatt> Forgive me for waxing philosophical. π
[20:07] <~Dan> π
[20:08] <+menlow> I like that, that’s what always drew me to the game. We always had maybe 1 person in the party that could use the Art when we played 2e. One of our main PCs was a video store clerk by trade.
[20:08] <+blackhatmatt> jcftao asked about horror movies. I was actually thinking about doing a blog post about this
[20:08] <+blackhatmatt> Many of Del Toro’s ghost stories (The Orphanage, Devil’s Backbone) are good Chill stories
[20:09] <+jcftao> How about the FX show, The Strain?
[20:09] <+blackhatmatt> It’s not a *great* movie, but the recent film Deliver Us From Evil is pretty perfect for Chill
[20:09] <+blackhatmatt> Haven’t watched it, sadly
[20:09] <+blackhatmatt> Species isn’t a bad Chill movie, insofar as there’s a team of people who are good at what they do tracking down something dangerous and deadly
[20:10] <+blackhatmatt> (It’s not a great movie, of course, but you can’t have everything)
[20:10] <~Dan> jcftao: I suspect that The Strain would be too much of a non-traditional take on vampires to fit in well with Chill.
[20:10] <+blackhatmatt> Eh. Consistency is the hobgoblin of small minds. π
[20:10] <~Dan> Well, certainly. But there’s also the fact that vampires in The Strain don’t seem to be supernatural.
[20:10] <+jcftao> lol:)
[20:11] <+blackhatmatt> Well, that’s a different thing
[20:11] <+blackhatmatt> But again, haven’t watched it
[20:11] * ~Dan nods
[20:11] <+blackhatmatt> So! Dan asked about the Evil Way
[20:11] <+blackhatmatt> Creatures are going to be able to do a lot of the same things, but we’ve made some tweaks in the service of making things easier on the CM
[20:11] <+blackhatmatt> Like, powers like Write don’t cost anything
[20:11] <+jcftao> Will there be any advantages or powers for a religious character or someone of strong faith?
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[20:11] <+blackhatmatt> Some powers just require a chip flip (like Quiet)
[20:12] <+blackhatmatt> Some nasty ones (Animation of the Dead, Erase Memory) add a light chip
[20:12] <~Dan> (Howdy, ArdentPurple!)
[20:12] <+blackhatmatt> We took the Disciplines like Rain, Earthquake, Lighting Call and grouped them under one umbrella called (I think) Master Element
[20:12] <+blackhatmatt> jcftao: Not as such. Some creatures are repulsed by “holy” objects, sure, but just as many seem to be atheists. π
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[20:13] <+blackhatmatt> Having strong faith might be a good reason to take a high Focus and Personality (and therefore have a high Willpower), or take Edges that boost Resolve checks
[20:13] <+jcftao> atheist vampires π
[20:13] <+blackhatmatt> Yeah, like in the movie Once Bitten. π
[20:13] <+blackhatmatt> (Not a good Chill movie)
[20:14] <~Dan> (Not a good movie movie.)
[20:14] <+blackhatmatt> No, not really.
[20:14] <+blackhatmatt> Next!
[20:15] <~Dan> Seems like I saw somewhere that actual magic would be addressed at some point. Did I imagine that?
[20:15] <+blackhatmatt> We have plans to do a sourcebook in which we’ll talk about magic, as distinct from the Art
[20:15] <+blackhatmatt> But that’s down the pike a ways
[20:16] <+blackhatmatt> Gotta get this KS funded first. π
[20:16] <~Dan> So in the meantime, does a witch just have a bunch of Evil Way powers?
[20:16] <+blackhatmatt> Yeah. Now, someone who is functionally human but uses the Evil Way, the CM would have a choice
[20:17] <+blackhatmatt> You could stat the character like an envoy (withe full range of skills, attributes, etc)
[20:17] <+blackhatmatt> Or stat them like a creature
[20:17] * ~Dan nods
[20:17] <+blackhatmatt> Either would work
[20:17] <~Dan> Is there a unified explanation for the Unknown and/or a central Big Bad?
[20:17] <+blackhatmatt> If you’re going for themes of “can we straight-up murder this person? Can we fix them instead?”, maybe hew closer to the envoy rules, but that’s still very behind-the-screen stuff
[20:18] <+blackhatmatt> Dan: Nope
[20:18] <+blackhatmatt> Envoys might want there to be
[20:18] <+blackhatmatt> “Maybe if we could just kill *this* monster”
[20:18] <+blackhatmatt> But it’s not that simple
[20:18] * ~Dan nods
[20:18] <+blackhatmatt> The Unknown is…the Unknown
[20:18] <~Dan> Is the Unknown uniformly hostile?
[20:18] <+blackhatmatt> Sometimes smart creatures plot and play long cons, but just as often creatures just want to kill people
[20:19] <~Dan> I mean, obviously that’s what SAVE would be worried about, but are all ghosts evil, for example?
[20:19] <+blackhatmatt> Evil is as evil does
[20:20] <+blackhatmatt> There’s a creatures in…Horrors of North America, one of the 2nd Ed books, I think
[20:20] <+blackhatmatt> Called a Guardian Spirit
[20:20] <+blackhatmatt> It just wants to protect something or someone
[20:20] <+blackhatmatt> And it starts off helpful
[20:20] <+blackhatmatt> But it loses touch with reality, and eventually ends up deciding that anything that comes near its charge has to die
[20:20] <+blackhatmatt> That’s the Unknown – it’s not always evil, but it’s always inhuman
[20:21] <+jcftao> SAVE was played pretty much straight up in 1st ed. Will SAVE envoys ever feel that they can’t trust their co-workers? You had mentioned infiltration in the SAVE history.
[20:21] <+jcftao> Or is that a CM decision?
[20:21] <~Dan> (brb — please continue)
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[20:22] <+blackhatmatt> Ah, crap, sorry!
[20:22] <+blackhatmatt> Connection dropped. Where were we?
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[20:24] <+blackhatmatt> Hang on, Michelle’s catching me up
[20:25] <+blackhatmatt> OK, got it. jcftao asked about infiltration
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[20:25] <+GenoFoxx> you were describing characteristics of the unknown and how some creatures may start off beneficial they may end up being extremely dangerous
[20:25] <~Dan> (Howdy, Teller!)
[20:25] <+blackhatmatt> It’s a CM decision to a point, but really more like a group decision
[20:25] <+blackhatmatt> Like, if that’s the kind of game you want to play, awesome! You just discuss that while doing the HQ design
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[20:26] <+blackhatmatt> And certainly some creatures are dangerous because of their capacity to infiltrate
[20:26] <+JoeMoon> There was a discovery the SAVE founder made about the Unknown in 2e. Will that be followed up on in 3e? Am I being to circumspect with that question.
[20:26] <+blackhatmatt> Next?
[20:26] <+blackhatmatt> JoeMoon: No, I know what you mean. π
[20:27] <+blackhatmatt> Yes, that will get addressed
[20:27] <+blackhatmatt> But the SAVE founder might have inflated his own importance a little
[20:27] <~Dan> How extensive will the new bestiary be, and on a related note, can you comment on any sorts of creatures that don’t really fit in a Chill game?
[20:27] <~Dan> (He was trying to SAVE face.)
[20:27] <+GenoFoxx> *groan*
[20:28] <+blackhatmatt> Dan: Danielle sent me a list, and it looks pretty comprehensive – the basics (vampires, ghosts, werewolves) are covered, along with some stranger critters harvested from mythology and other Chill books
[20:28] <+blackhatmatt> I should mention, too, that there’s a reward level on the KS that lets the backer add a creature to the book. Just saying. π
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[20:28] <+blackhatmatt> Creatures that don’t fit into a Chill game: Hmm. I don’t think aliens and other sci-fi kind of creatures work especially well
[20:29] <+jcftao> Any chance that you will have Elvira on the cover of a supplement? π
[20:29] <+blackhatmatt> And you have to be careful with things like infective werewolves and zombies, because that can get out of hand quickly, but they do work
[20:29] <+blackhatmatt> jcftao: Not even a small chance. π
[20:29] <+jcftao> darn!
[20:30] <+blackhatmatt> Buy a Traitor reward level, we’ll add “Mistress of the Dark” to the bestiary
[20:30] <+jcftao> lol
[20:30] <+blackhatmatt> That’s as close as we’re likely to get
[20:30] <+blackhatmatt> Next!
[20:30] <+menlow> How did you decide to tackle this project, after the 3e Chill by Otherworld never really got off the ground several years ago?
[20:30] <+blackhatmatt> Pure love of the game
[20:30] <+menlow> awesome
[20:30] <+blackhatmatt> Chill was my first horror game, and I mused aloud to my wife that I wished we could get the rights, but I didn’t know who owned it
[20:31] <+blackhatmatt> She did some digging because she’s awesome, found Martin, we contacted him, and here we are
[20:31] <+Martin> Other World Creations didn’t have the rights to do a third edition.
[20:32] <+blackhatmatt> Well, I don’t know anything about that
[20:32] <+jcftao> You mentioned in the kickstarter that you played 3-4 games per week for a couple years, I believe. Did you run a long campaign or monster hunting episodes with different characters?
[20:32] <+blackhatmatt> jcftao: Both!
[20:32] <+jcftao> nice
[20:32] <+blackhatmatt> I was in college at the time, and my groups consisted of people from my classes, buddies from high school, people I met at work…
[20:32] <+JoeMoon> That explains a lot (former TWC playtester)
[20:33] <+blackhatmatt> I probably had 100 different regular players over a 2-year period, plus maybe 40-50 more one-timers
[20:33] <~Dan> How strict is the game when it comes to creature vulnerabilities? For example, if a werewolf is only vulnerable to silver, does that mean that it can sit chuckling to itself at ground zero of a tactical nuke? Or are there limits?
[20:33] <+blackhatmatt> The game was basically a series of one-shots, because my friends were busy (and flaky) and I never knew who I’d get
[20:33] <+blackhatmatt> So missions got a little…eclectic
[20:34] <+blackhatmatt> But there was an ongoing mythology, and I ran an end-of-the-world series where the Greater Zombie Master called up all the dead in Arlington to march on DC
[20:34] <+blackhatmatt> That was fun
[20:34] <+blackhatmatt> Dan: Depends on the creature
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[20:35] * ~Dan nods
[20:35] <+blackhatmatt> I mean, technically, the werewolf might survive that, under a strict read of the rules. But I’m not interested in white room combat or silly hypotheticals. So, my question would be: Where the hell did the envoys get a tac-nuke?
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[20:35] <+blackhatmatt> Who’s going to clean up that mess?
[20:36] <~Dan> An extreme example, I confess. π
[20:36] <~Dan> (Howdy, BPIJonathan!)
[20:36] <+blackhatmatt> I mean, the blast might kill that werewolf, sure, but the Unknown feeds on misery – how much misery does that blast cause?
[20:36] <~Dan> (One of your fellow game authors, there, blackhatmatt. *indicates BPIJonathan*)
[20:36] <+blackhatmatt> Everything in context
[20:36] * ~Dan nods
[20:37] <+blackhatmatt> I don’t know. He could be a creature of the Unknown masquerading as Jonathan
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[20:37] <+BPIJonathan> Thats true, seemsΒ you found me out π
[20:37] <+Jonathan_FIK> It’s true. There are even multiple Jonathan’s involved which means that it could get super confusing.
[20:37] <+Jonathan_FIK> Just ripe for the Unknown.
[20:37] <+blackhatmatt> Serioulsy
[20:37] <+blackhatmatt> Next question!
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[20:38] <+jcftao> Can a creature be affected by something it believes in strongly? For example, if religion has no aspects in the rules, but a ghostly creature may be exorcised by a religious ritual because it believes the ritual can harm it?
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[20:38] <+blackhatmatt> Sure
[20:38] <~Dan> Well, to give a less silly example… some games treat creature vulnerabilities as something that they just have more trouble recovering from — like, say, a werewolf that can regenerate, but not from silver- or fire-caused damage.
[20:38] <+blackhatmatt> A lot of times, with ghosts, it’s about playing to their world view and helping them move on
[20:38] <~Dan> Others just say, nope, no silver, no damage.
[20:38] <~Dan> Is one approach or the other more “Chill”?
[20:39] <+blackhatmatt> Dan: Probably more that the werewolf can regenerate, but it might take longer if the damage is extreme
[20:39] <+blackhatmatt> But again, depends on the werewolf
[20:39] <+blackhatmatt> There are multiple different kinds
[20:39] * ~Dan nods
[20:39] <+blackhatmatt> Next!
[20:40] <~Dan> Are most Chill adventures based around one sort of creature?
[20:40] <+Martin> What about Voodoo, Matthew?
[20:40] <+blackhatmatt> Two good questions!
[20:40] * ~Dan high-fives Martin!
[20:41] <+blackhatmatt> Dan: Depends. Some creatures have servitors, so you’d have a major and minor menace
[20:41] <+blackhatmatt> I’ve had good results running games where there are two creatures working at cross-purposes or just parallel, and the envoys think it’s all one thing until they get in there and untangle it
[20:41] <+blackhatmatt> But you don’t want to do that too often
[20:42] <+blackhatmatt> It can feel overwrought, and unfocused
[20:42] * ~Dan nods
[20:42] <+blackhatmatt> And the best way to run a mission, IMO, is to really focus on the creature and the effect it’s having on the people around it, or on the environment
[20:42] <+blackhatmatt> What are the stakes? Good question to ask
[20:43] <+blackhatmatt> If the envoys feel like they can just leave this alone because it’s never going to hurt anyone, then eh
[20:43] <+blackhatmatt> You want them to feel like this is important
[20:43] <+blackhatmatt> So multiple creatures can do that, but it can get overwhelming
[20:43] <+blackhatmatt> Martin: Voodoo
[20:43] <+blackhatmatt> So, I like that sourcebook
[20:44] <+blackhatmatt> But at the same time, I have to be mindful that there really are people who practice vodoun. It’s a real culture
[20:44] <+blackhatmatt> And although the book addressed that, I get uncomfortable mining living cultures for games like this, especially when it casts practitioners as monsters
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[20:44] <+blackhatmatt> The Voodoo book did a decent job of putting the culture in context (it’s been a while since I read it, mind)
[20:45] <+blackhatmatt> But in the Chill core, we’re not going to have room to do that, so I’m inclined to leave it alone
[20:45] <+blackhatmatt> Plus the Voodoo book is still available for purchase anyway. π
[20:45] <+blackhatmatt> Next!
[20:46] <~Dan> Now, I know that Mythos type creatures would be redundant, but do beings of godlike power fit in the setting? Or are most of the creatures lower-key?
[20:46] <+blackhatmatt> Well, “lower key” is a matter of perspective
[20:46] <~Dan> Certainly.
[20:47] <+blackhatmatt> There probably are godlike creatures, but as the CM, I’d be wary of using things like that
[20:47] * ~Dan nods
[20:47] <~Dan> I’d also think that until you incorporate magic into the setting, such things would be particularly hard to address.
[20:47] <+blackhatmatt> The CM has to be mindful of what the envoys can accomplish. Thematically, I personally would find “learn the truth and be horrified” as unsatisfying in Chill
[20:48] <~Dan> There is that as well.
[20:48] <+blackhatmatt> Though in Trail of Cthulhu, that’s be perfectly appropriate
[20:48] * ~Dan nods
[20:48] <~Dan> Okay, so! Quick pause here, folks!
[20:48] <+blackhatmatt> So if the CM is using a really powerful creature as the enemy, she’d need to consider: a) what’s the endgame? and b) are the envoys ever going to learn the full scope of what’s happening?
[20:49] <+blackhatmatt> Sounds more like a full campaign thing to me
[20:49] <~Dan> blackhatmatt: As I have hopefully already told you, game authors are always welcome here to promote their work. That being the case, you are more than welcome to hang out with us as long as you like to answer questions. (Or just to hang out, for that matter.)
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[20:50] <~Dan> That said, in what remains of “regular time”, is there anything we haven’t covered that you’d like to bring up?
[20:50] <~Dan> (Howdy, cdaniel!)
[20:50] <+blackhatmatt> Umm…
[20:50] <+blackhatmatt> Yeah, I’d like to remind everyone that if you back the KS, you get the quickstart, no matter what level
[20:50] <~Dan> (If not, no problem. We can just ask more questions.)
[20:50] <+blackhatmatt> Link’s in the first update
[20:51] <~Dan> Oh, speaking of which, would you like to post the link to the KS? π
[20:51] <+blackhatmatt> The quickstart is fully laid out, has awesome artwork, gives a pretty good indication of what the book will look like
[20:51] <+blackhatmatt> (Link: https://www.kickstarter.com/projects/playattentiongames/chill-3rd-edition-a-horror-roleplaying-game)https://www.kickstarter.com/projects/playattentiongames/chill-3rd-edition-a-horror-roleplaying-game
[20:51] <+jcftao> Matthew, this is definitely a game I want to play. Best of luck with your kickstarter! I am backing it, but now I will up my contribution. Thanks.
[20:52] <+blackhatmatt> Though I should mention that there’s going to be an update QS posted within the next week or so, incorporating some of the things I talked about here (the skills, most notably)
[20:52] <+blackhatmatt> Thank you!
[20:52] <+blackhatmatt> This is totally a labor of love for me, and I’m really glad it’s going so well. π
[20:52] <~Dan> Oh! That reminds me: Are there any skills beyond those one-per-attribute skills?
[20:52] <+blackhatmatt> Nope
[20:53] <+blackhatmatt> Those are the skills that we figure you’ll be using in an investigation
[20:53] <~Dan> So how do you handle skills that fall outside that scope?
[20:53] <+Martin> I invite you to like the Chill official Facebook page: (Link: https://www.facebook.com/chillrpg)https://www.facebook.com/chillrpg
[20:53] <+blackhatmatt> There’s an Edge called Body of Knowledge, that adds to rolls that don’t fall under the skills but that a character might use
[20:53] <~Dan> Ah, I see.
[20:53] <+blackhatmatt> So one of the characters in the QS is a bounty hunter; he has Body of Knowledge: Bounty Hunter
[20:54] <~Dan> Is that what would be required for, say, computer hacking?
[20:54] <+blackhatmatt> If he were to roll to know, say, criminal law, it wouldn’t necessarily be covered by a skill, but he could roll Focus and add the bonus from Body of Knowledge
[20:54] <+blackhatmatt> Yeah, I think so
[20:54] * ~Dan nods
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[20:55] <~Dan> Oh, another thing I forgot: Damage seemed awfully clunky in previous editions. How does it work in 3e?
[20:56] <+blackhatmatt> Remember that Injury stuff I went through earlier?
[20:57] <~Dan> The base damage stuff?
[20:57] <+blackhatmatt> Yup
[20:57] * ~Dan nods
[20:57] <+blackhatmatt> That’s how damage works (or maybe I don’t understand the question)
[20:58] <~Dan> Well, to be more specific, IIRC there was stunning damage and injuries in the previous editions.
[20:58] <+blackhatmatt> Oh, right
[20:58] <+JoeMoon> There’s Stamina loss on top of the injury level, too, correct?
[20:59] <+blackhatmatt> Yes
[20:59] <+blackhatmatt> But envoys have 4 wound levels
[20:59] <+blackhatmatt> Each has a number attached to it
[20:59] <+blackhatmatt> Take a Minor Injury, you lose 10 Stamina and take a -10 to physical actions, and mark your Minor Injury box
[20:59] <+blackhatmatt> Take another Minor Injury, you lose 10 more Stamina
[21:00] <+JoeMoon> Will there be options for tinkering with lethality levels?
[21:00] <+blackhatmatt> It’s pretty simple, though I do want note that the combat/Injury system is going to get playtested further to make sure it not only works, but works under stress. π
[21:01] <+blackhatmatt> JoeMoon: Yeah, I don’t think that’d be hard to arrange
[21:01] <+blackhatmatt> Just lower the Stamina loss levels on the Injuries, that’d be a start
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[21:01] <+JoeMoon> That was my first thought
[21:02] <+JoeMoon> A lot has changed in the real world since 2e. Does the game take into account hunting “secret” monsters in our always connected society today?
[21:02] <@Silverlion> The Unknown blurs cameras, and debunks itself..:D
[21:02] <+BPIJonathan> (sorry, gotta go. Crisis to avert)
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[21:03] <+blackhatmatt> JoeMoon: It’s something we’ll address, yeah
[21:03] <+blackhatmatt> One of the things that came up in brainstorm is: Why doesn’t SAVE blow the lid off? They could
[21:03] <+Jonathan_FIK> I always say, never underestimate people’s ability to rationalize away.
[21:04] <+blackhatmatt> And the answer we came up with was: The Unknown seems to want to be found. It feeds on fear, after all
[21:04] <+blackhatmatt> And the world learning about it would cause *massive* panic
[21:04] <~Dan> Ah… So sort of a Deadlands scenario?
[21:04] <+blackhatmatt> So SAVE isn’t really sure that widespread knowledge is the best idea; they’d rather recruit
[21:04] <+blackhatmatt> Sort of, yeah
[21:04] <+JoeMoon> In my games, knowledge of the Unknown actually gives it power… A dangerous feedback loop of belief
[21:05] <~Dan> Seems like this would be a great game for playing Supernatural.
[21:05] <~Dan> (The TV show, I mean.)
[21:05] <+blackhatmatt> I haven’t watched it, actually!
[21:05] <~Dan> The early seasons, especially.
[21:05] <+blackhatmatt> It’s on my list
[21:05] <~Dan> Really? Wow…
[21:06] <+blackhatmatt> I know, I know
[21:06] <+blackhatmatt> I watch cooking shows. π
[21:06] <+blackhatmatt> And lots of movies
[21:07] <+blackhatmatt> OK, y’all, this has been fun, but I must away
[21:07] <~Dan> Well, at its heart, it’s about two brothers who are part of a loose network of monster hunters, traveling the country killing horrors to a classic rock soundtrack.
[21:07] <+blackhatmatt> Need my beauty sleep
[21:07] <+JoeMoon> Gotta sign off now. When will the log be up? Had connection problems the first hour
[21:07] <~Dan> Yup, me too. If you can hang on just a sec, though, I’ll get you the link to the log.
[21:07] <~Dan> And thanks for coming by, Matt!